Posts Tagged ‘poland’

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Importing a motorbike

Thursday, February 28th, 2008

I already blogged about my attempt at importing my van – basically I couldn’t. Well now having been here a bit longer and with a better grasp of Polish I am ready to tackle importing my motorbike.

Here’s what I did and how long it took. I have written everything down in detail as I did it. The only thing I haven’t mentioned is that the MOMENT YOU GET YOUR TEMPORARY BIKE REGISTRATION YOU ARE OBLIGED TO BUY INSURANCE THE SAME DAY. I found out the hard way – I thought that like in the UK and I presume other countries where logic and commen sense apply, you only need insurance if you want ot use the vehicle. I presumed you don’t need insurance if your vehicle is just sat in the garage. NOT IN POLAND – IF YOU OWN A VEHICLE IT MUST BE INSURED even if it’s off the road for 6 months. I will do another post at some time about insurance because that isn’t so straight forward either…

STEP 1 – TRANSPORT DEPARTMENT- TIME TAKEN: 2 hours

The first thing I did was go to the local office for the department of transport (wydział transportu i komunikacji). I explained to the guy there what I wanted to do, which is basically register my English bike which I bought many years ago in Poland where I am now living and temporarily registered. He told me that I need:

  1. Technical inspection (Badanie techniczne)
  2. Translation of my registration certificate into Polish (tłumaczenie dowodu rejestracyjnego)
  3. VAT declaration from the treasury department (zaświadcienie o zwolnienie z vatu)
  4. Certificate that I am registered in Poland (tymczasowe zameldowanie)

Now they might ask where you are permanently registered to live. If so you will have to explain/argue to them that you aren’t permanently registered in Poland because as a foreigner you can’t be, and that we don’t have such a system/requirement in England.

Also now is a good time to ask where the local translator is. You will have to use an approved translator, so they should either have a list or be able to point you in the right direction. They will definitely know where the German translators are because lots of Poles import cars from Germany. Luckily for me I found an English translator was in the same street.

STEP 2 – TRANSLATION – TIME TAKEN: 45 minutes. Cost 60 zl.

Next I found the English translator to get my registration certificate translated. Had to wait 2 days to collect it and paid 60 złoty. I was charged for 1 and a half pages to do a standard V5C UK registration certificate.

STEP 3 - TREASURY DEPARTMENT VISIT 1 – TIME TAKEN: 45 minutes

Next I went to the treasury department (urząd skarbowy). Unfortunately in Poland you have to report to them everytime you borrow money, lend money, buy a car or fart. I found the department responsible for VAT and explained to them that I want to import my English bike.
They asked for my receipt from when I bought it – documents like this are extremely important in Poland, unlike the UK, where you don’t need to report all financial transactions. This was my first major problem. I had to explain that I bought the bike many years ago from a friend and don’t have a receipt. After a lot of head scratching and phone calls she decided that I had to return with:

  • form VAT-24 - this is a form about importing a vehicle from abroad and paying VAT on it (yes that’s right – unlike the UK in Poland you pay VAT on second hand vehicles)
  • form NIP-3 – this is a form so that I can get a Polish NIP number so that the treasury department can then keep tabs on me
  • a declaration (oświadczenie) signed by me, in Polish, that I bought the bike 4 years ago in the UK where I was living, I used the bike in Poland and I brought the bike to Poland when I moved here.

STEP 4 - TECHNICAL INSPECTION – TIME TAKEN: 1hr. Cost 116 zl.

Time to find a garage where I can get my technical inspection done. I did ask at the transport department but they said that almost all garages do these inspections. I asked at a local tyre shop where I know the owner and he told me about a local garage where they do technical inspections – stacja kontroli pojazdów. I went there and after scratching their heads for a bit, looking at the headlights and looking at my polish translation of my registration certificate they decided they couldn’t do it because ‘they don’t have the data for this motorbike’. What that means exactly I don’t know – maybe they don’t usually do motorbikes or maybe they weren’t confident about doing a foreign vehicle. They suggested another (bigger) garage locally.

So a month later with the weather having warmed up a bit more I went to the second garage. I asked the bloke if he could do an inspection on an English bike and he said sure no problem. He spent about 5 seconds looking at the bike, asked me to show him that all the lights worked and then asked me to follow him inside. To my suprise he sat there for a few minutes and then gave me two certificates:

  1. “Dokument Identyfikacyjny Pojazdu zarejestrowanego po raz pierwszy za granicą“, meaning something along the lines of “ID document for foreign vehicle registered for the first time in Poland”. It has a list of 40 technical points on it such as country of production, country of previous registration etc..
  2. Zaświadczenie o przeprowadzonym badaniu technicznym pojazdu which is basically the MOT certificate.

So it appears that if you can find a garage happy to do the paperwork then as long as your vehicle looks like it doesn’t have any wheels missing and has got lights then this step isn’t a problem. Cost 116 zloty.

STEP 5 – TREASURY DEPARTMENT VISIT 2 – TIME TAKEN: 1 hr. Cost 160 zl.

Went back to the treasury department with my forms filled out as best as I could. The woman at the VAT window was expecting me following my first visit there, so had been informed by her colleagues about the English guy with his motorbike and thankfully I didn’t have to explain everything all over again. She was very helpful and helped me correct my forms. I had to go to a 2nd window to hand in my NIP form, then to the till window to pay a flat fee of 160 złoty. I haven’t quite worked out what that fee was for, I guess for the priviledge of importing a vehicle to Poland. Also for some reason the first till window sent me to the 2nd till window (more queuing), and she did something on the computer then sent me back to the 1st till window to pay (more queuing). Where the logic is in that I don’t know…
After paying I went back the the VAT window, showed her my payment receipt and she told me to come back in 2 days to collect my declaration (oświadczenie) to show I have taken care of the VAT for this vehicle.

STEP 6 – TREASURY DEPARTMENT – VISIT 3 – TIME TAKEN: 10 minutes

As instructed I went back to collect my confirmation that they are happy with the VAT for this bike and they gave me a form called a VAT-25 which they had typed up and put official looking stamps and signatures on. Suprisingly it was there waiting for me and there was no queue. Brilliant.

STEP 7 – TRAN
SPORT DEPARTMENT- VISIT 2 – TIME TAKEN: 1 hour. Cost 188 zl.

Went back to the transport department with all of my documents. Was told that I couldn’t register the bike today because I hadn’t made an appointment. Gave him a sob-story about having a little baby at home and sick wife. Was told to fill out the registration form (wniosek), go to the till and pay 188 zloty. After 15 minutes he emerged with:

  • Temporary vehicle permit (pozwolenie czasowe)
  • My VAT-25 form with a stamp on it that it has been used to register the vehicle
  • A photocopy of my UK registration certificate again with stamps on it
  • A shiny new number plate!

Unfortunately because my temporary residence registration runs out in 2 weeks time I have to go back again then to collect the regular vehicle permit.

STEP 8 – TRANSPORT DEPARTMENT- VISIT 3 – TIME TAKEN: 10 minutes

Got my new temporary residence certificate so returned to the transport department. I was pleasently surprised to find no queue and a helpful attendant. After just a few minutes I got my karta pojazdu and permit no problem. FINISHED!

TOTAL COST: 524 zloty and 6 hours of time

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Posted in bureacracy, vehicles and driving | 12 Comments »

English cars in Poland

Thursday, February 28th, 2008

Last year (2007) I already tried to register my English van over here, but after spending a lot of time having friends check with local garages and having my wife call various government offices I discovered that I can’t. You can’t register right-hand-drive (RHD) vehicles in Poland. Don’t let anyone tell you different – you will not be able to get the technical examination certificate (badanie techniczne) which you will require.

Now you might see right-hand-drive vehicles over here or know someone who knows someone who’s got one. This is perfectly possible because a number of years ago you could do it if you were able to demonstrate that you had experience of driving RHD vehicles on the right of the road. But that was stopped a number of years ago (I don’t know when exactly).
This seems unfair to me given that you can register LHD vehicles in the UK, or register English RHD vehicles in France, but that’s the rules I’m afraid.

So if you have a car here from England you have 3 choices (to stay legal):

  1. Continue to pay your UK insurance, return once a year to do your MOT, renew your tax disc on the internet. This is the simplest solution but with two catches – the first is that insurance in the UK costs a lot. The 2nd is that technically you are not allowed to have your car here for more than 12 months. But if you return every 12 months for the MOT then the clock starts again.
  2. Convert your car from RHD to LHD. I don’t know anyone who’s done that because the cost of it probably isn’t justifiable. Labour is cheap in Poland but I am sure that would still be a big garage bill, not to mention that cost of new parts (dashboard, steering rack etc..)
  3. Sell your car. Buy a local one.

If you don’t stay legal (i.e. your insurance runs out while your here) then if you are stopped by the police and can’t produce your documents there and then (you do always carry them with your right?) there is a chance your car will be impounded. Also I don’t think it’s worth the risk of driving without insurance anyway. It’s one of those things that you don’t need when you have, and always need when you don’t.

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Posted in vehicles and driving | 52 Comments »

Foreigners in Poland – registration “zameldowanie”

Thursday, February 28th, 2008

Thanks to Paweł from Polandian for his comments which I have used to update this blog post.

One of the biggest shocks about living in Poland for the average foreigner has got to be the bureaucracy. In fact if I have to list 3 downers about living here they would be:

  1. Unbelievable amount of bureaucracy to do anything in day to day life (register a car, buy a house, get a mobile phone, open a bank account, do anything at the post office…)
  2. Lack of indian and chinese take-aways.
  3. Did I mention the bureaucracy?

Unfortunately if you decide to live here (or already are) you will have to resign yourself to the fact that that is just the way it is and take it on the chin. The Poles don’t like it either and allegedly are slowly making things better. In fact because the procedures for doing things are in the process of change that can often add to the confusion – very often you are given out of date information or told different things by people or offices.

Anyway the first thing you will need to do is something called registration (zameldowanie). In what seems to me like an unreasonable breach of civil liberties you are legally required to be registered to an address to live here. If you aren’t registered then effectively you are just a tourist in Poland and not living here.

Many expats live in Poland for a long time and don’t bother to register – I didn’t until I had been here for at least 6 months. I have been told that it is legally compulsory but I don’t see how the authorities have any way to check how long you’ve been here or whether they even care that much about it.

So why register at all? Simply because at some point you might want to work here or buy a car or rent a flat and if you aren’t registered then you won’t be able to.

[UPDATE - I have been assured that you don't need to be registered to rent or buy property or to work locally. You don't need to be registered to by a car but you do if you want to register it to your name in Poland]

There are two types of registration – temporary (tymczasowy) or permanent (na stałe). As foreigners we aren’t currently allowed to register permanently. I know we are supposed to all be in the EU now, but it doesn’t feel that way.

[UPDATE - don't listen to the voices! Apparently if you have a karta pobytu then you can indeed register permanently according to the council in gdynia]

You can register temporarily for a maximum period of 3 months. That means every 3 months you will have to re-register. I have been told that I can register for up to 5 years but to do that I have to go to Kraków and frankly I can’t be bothered at the moment with the journey.

To register or re-register you will need to:

  • personally go during office hours (usually 8am – 4pm Mon-Fri) to the local town hall (urząd gmina) and find the office where they do registrations (zameldowanie).
  • take your passport
  • take with you the landlord or owner of the address at which you need to register – they need to sign that they agree for you to live there
  • take with you someone who speaks Polish if neither of you do. Don’t expect anyone to speak English, but be suprised if they do.

Don’t ask what happens if you work during office hours, are ill in hospital or elderly. The concept of dealing with these matters by post or internet is about as remote as me flying into space with a london oyster card.

Also don’t ask what happens if you don’t have anyone to sign you on to their address. If you are going to be renting a flat then this will be part of the procedure (and this also gives the landlord the power to evict you very easily by revoking your registration).

[UPDATE - an authorative source tells me that you don't necessarily need your landlord or property owner with you in person - if you have written entitlement to the property than that should suffice. In my experience that didn't work at my urząd miasta, but the next time I go to re-register I will try and do it with just my legal documents and will be ready to argue!]

When you do your registration they will ask you lots of apparently random questions such as what your parent’s names are. I don’t know why. Maybe if you’re naughty they will send a note home to them.

Finally expect a queue and to lose at least part of your day (if not all of it). That way if it only takes you an hour or so you will be pleasantly suprised rather than incredibly annoyed.

Let me know if you have anything to add, or what your experience of “zameldowanie” is like….

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Posted in bureacracy, residency | 15 Comments »

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